Strikeforce Diaz vs. Daley CompuStrike Review: Time for Computerized Scoring System?
Posted on April 12, 2011, 03:55 AM by Ryan Ventura
Last Saturday's Strikeforce: Diaz vs. Daley event was one of the ages, with majority of the bouts ending with a dramatic finish. Three out of four bouts on the main card ended with a decisive finish. The one fight that ended in a uniamous draw was the bout between "The Dean of Mean" Keith Jardine and Gegard Mousasi. Thanks to the good people at Compustrike, we were able to follow every strike, every takedown, and every submission attepmpt. Let's take closer look at Strikeforce's main card from last Saturday.
Nick Diaz (4:57 First round TKO) vs. Paul Daley:
-The dramatic main event between MMA bad boys Nick Diaz and Paul Daley lived up to the hype. As soon as the bell rang, both men came out swinging. Nick Diaz landed 54/88 (61%) strikes, 31 of those strikes were power shots, 15 of the landed strikes were on the ground. Paul Daley landed 36/76 (47%), 19 of them were power strikes, 12 of them were on the ground.
-Paul Daley unsuccessfully attempted 2 takedowns.
-The two combatants landed a combined 90 strikes in round one, with 164 strikes being thrown.
Gilbert Melendez (3:14 First rount TKO) vs. Tatsuya Kawajiri:
-"The Crusher" Tatsuya Kawajiri was domininated by "El Nino" Gilbert Melendez. Gilbert landed 45/72 (62%) of his strikes. 38 of those strikes were power shots, 21 of them were on the ground. Kawajiri was only able to land 15/37 (41%) of his strikes and 5 of them were power strikes.
-"El Nino" scored one takedown the whole fight, but one was all he needed to help him destroy "The Crusher".
Gegard Mousasi vs. Keith Jardine (Unanimous draw):
-If you watched the fights from last Saturday night, you could clearly see that Keith Jardine was being purely outclassed by Gegard Mousasi. Jardine was outstruck by Mousasi 124/211 (59%), compared to Jardine's 45/142 (32%). 69 of Mousasi's strikes were power shots, Jardine landed 12 the whole fight. 40 of Mousasi's strikes were also landed from the ground.
-Jardine did beat Mousasi in the takedown department. Jardine was able to take Mousasi down 6/9 times, but Mousasi was able to take down Jardine 2/3 times. Both men attempted two submissions, however Mousasi was able to find a dominant position once.
-The one stat that isn't recorded is illegal shots. The most likely reason for the unanimous draw, was due to the point deduction from the illegal upkick Mousasi landed while on his back in the first round. If the point wasn't deducted, according to Compustrike, Mousasi should have won.
Shinya Aoki (1:33 First round submission) vs. Lyle Beerbohm:
-The only stat Lyle Beerbohm beat Shinya Aoki in was the striking department. Lyle was able to land 2/3 (67%) of his strikes, Aoki threw 2 strikes the whole fight, and landed none.
-Aoki took down Beerbohm once, found dominate position, attempted one submission, and won.
Final thoughts:
Once again Strikeforce delivered a very entertaining and fun night of fights. However, the bout between Keith Jardine and Gegard Mousasi once again exposed flaws in the judging system in Mixed Martial Arts. A lot of the people who are assigned to judge bouts, are not always the most knowledgable people in the sport. Not only should judges and official be properly educated and trained, I think it's time that officials adopt tools like Compustrike to help make accurate decisions.
Simply judging a fight with the naked eye or solely relying on technology to make proper decisions is not effective. I believe a proper combination knowing what you are watching accompanied by computerized stats will help improve the way fights are judged.
You see the numbers, you see the facts. You be the judge and express your thoughts in the comment box! Also thanks again to Compustrike for the numbers and we encourage you all to visit them for all your MMA stats!
Photo: Nick Diaz celebrates his victory over Gleison Tibau during the Ultimate Fighting Championship UFC 65 at the Arco Arena in Sacramento, CA, on November 18, 2006. Photo credit: Francis Specker.
Comments
Mousasi - Jardine a draw because of the takedowns. Why are takedowns so important when it comes to scoring even if you do nothing with them?! Jardine didn't hit Mousasi twice when he took him down. Something needs to change. Scoring needs to start when you punch someone in the face or body if you take him down, not with the takedown itself. If you have the better position then do the damage dammit! You hit a guy in the face 30-40 times, but he took you down 3 times in a round and hit you 5 times while you ware there and he wins the round? Wtf?!
I couldn't agree more, Jardine did nothing to win the first round yet I assume that is the round the judges gave him due to what 3 takedowns which Moussasi got up from easily and did more damage to Jardine then he other way around. Something is very wrong with the scoring system in MMA. A takedown should be scored about the same as backing up an opponent.
I agree, that was a very bad decision, but I can't agree with you saying a takedown should only count as much as backing someone up. If you have ever wrestled, you would know the energy thats goes into a takedown, and it may not look always look like it, but a lot of skill also. As Joe Rogan says, the ref shouldn't stand them up either, the guy on bottom needs to learn to get up. I don't always agree with that, but it is a thought. It's not boxing or kick-boxing, it's MMA.
Aoki had the highest striking percentage 2/3 lol
Mousasi won on damage alone but i think he should have gotten a warning for the upkick and not a point deduction the first time he did it. I don't know how Jardine can keep a straight face and say he won.
Great fight by Jardine on such short notice though. Hope they rematch them and Daley and Diaz too. Best fight night so far this year.
Because it is mixed martial arts, not K1. I think of it like BJJ, if you get a takedown in a comp, that is 2 points. Your takedown only has to last 3 seconds on the ground and those two points are still yours.
If we are truly trying to make a clash of styles (Which is what the UFC was made to do), then why would you only award points for strikers? Taking someone down is showing dominance. And in other sports that lead onto MMA, are counted. As are moving to side control, mount, taking the back etc.
They score the fight on a number of factors: effective striking, grappling, takedowns, aggression, and cage control. In the first round, Jardine was more aggressive, dictated the pace of the fight, controlled the cage, clinched Mousasi against the cage a lot, and took him down multiple times. Mousasi outstruck Jardine, but didn't do so in dramatic fashion during round one. Jardine wins the round due to superior control and aggression.
After round one, Mousasi was much better about defending against the grappling, pushed the pace a little bit, and became an aggressive counter puncher. If he fought in the first round the way he did in the last two, he would have one the fight. With the upkick point deduction, the draw is justified.
Imagine round 1 was a draw n with the point out Jardine..last 2 mousasi.. winner Mousasi LOL
I think fights should be judged the fight in its total and not by round...in case of doubt.. extra round
What about damage?
What about it? Some people bleed easy, some people get in a few good shots and then nothing for the rest of the round. Damage is part of effective striking, but it isn't a primary consideration for the judges. The thing that lost Mousasi the first round in the eyes of two judges was that he wasn't aggressive enough. More damage or not, he was letting Jardine dictate the fight.
Even the large number of strikes as a difference in offensive output between the two fighters is misleading in this case on paper. Mousasi outstruck Jardine by a great deal, but most of his stikes were in the clinch (where Jardine was going for a takedown) or from the bottom on the ground. Of the striking between the two while standing, the output was much more even, with Mousasi only outstriking Jardine 10-7 in round one.
It was actually Fancy Pants that landed 2/3 lol.
I think Mousasi won the fight but I think with the point deduction a draw is justifiable.
For example - Jardine won the 1st round on TD's... and with the point deduction made it a 10 -8 round for KJ. Then Mousasi wins the next two rounds 10 -9, 10-9
So
10-8 KJ, 10-9 GM, 10-9GM = 28-28 on the judges scorecards, resulting in a draw...
But i ask....scoring by round is accurate enough?? not even questioning wut u think its more important or not..... some1 fights better and its more efective..... but in a round 10 points sistem is guilty 4 MMA being corrupted by wrestlers, cuz they found fails in this sistem.....the 10 points system its very inaccurate about how the fight did really happen
i beleave it should be scored in its total, extra round in case of doubt 2 correct these mistakes, allow kick 2 ground, upkicks.... i think allowing elbows is giving wrestling fighters somehow an advantage.... allowing kicks down n upkicks makes it much more equilibrated....
the wrestling fighters discovered a hole in MMA rules and they should be adapted in order 2 equilibrate
if compustrike did a round by round score you would notice that the striking in the first round was very close add three takedowns jardine won the first. yes he went on to get dominated in the last two but it doesnt change the fact it was a technical draw. it seems to be the fad these days that everytime someones preferred fighter loses a close decision to call a robbery. honestly the only thing worse than the judges are all the butthurt fanboys complaining about the judges
I'm looking at the compustrike numbers right now for the first round. Mousasi landed 46/77 (60%) strikes, 27 of them power shots. Jardine landed 17/53 (32%), four power strikes. Jardine scored 4/5 takedowns.
I'm not arguing the first round, everyone should know that Mousasi lost that round, especially with the lost point. But what about the 2nd and 3rd rounds?
I think it's a stupid criteria, simply because takedowns really don't do any damage, you just get the better position. Judges should count the strikes that you do when you get the takedown, not the takedown itself. And in this case Jardine didn't do almost any strikes, if nothing he got punched in the face more even when he was in the top position.
Just because the company is called 'Compustrike' does not mean computers have anything to do with the scoring--except as a glorified adding machine and to implement their own proprietorial algorithm which 'weighs' all the different inputs.
Let's get this straight.
1. CompuStrike hires people to count the strikes at an event and evaluate whether the strike was 'significant' or not.
2. CompuStrike inputs the counts from these human counters into their 'program'. Not really much computation is done except to average the human counter's results.
Salient questions might be:
How many human counters are used per fight?
What are their qualifications to judge MMA fights?
Explain exactly how the algorithm used to weigh the results is accurate and does the job it claims to do.
The bottom line is that CompuStrike is HumanStrike with the benefit of slow motion replay and time and luxury to come out with a decision well after the fight is over.
The solution for bad judging is to get better judges. The solution to bad rules is to get better rules.
I do believe judges should have televisions and not judge only by eye.
I agree. The cameras usually have a much better angle. Ever been to a NFL game and watched from the sideline? you can't see anything. The same could be true for fights-if the angle is wrong, what can the judge see? Someone"s back?
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